"Austin P. So (Hae Jin)" <haejin@netinfo.ubc.ca> wrote in message
news:bd7gu0$34l$4@nntp.itservices.ubc.ca...
>
> "USA" <USA@aol.com> wrote in message
> news:cPFIa.1192$L11.207@newssvr16.news.prodigy.com...
> > > > Two known apologists for North Korea.
> > >
> > > Me? Not really...though I do think there are circumstances which cause
> > > nations to behave irrationally and almost barbarically.
> > >
> > > Say...how are them 1000+ ethnic arabs doing "in cummunicado" anyway
> > without
> > > due process? And what about those POW...oh sorry...what do you call
them
> > > again?..."enemy combatants" doing in Guantanimo Bay CUBA?
>
> > There are many aspects to what is happening in the US that in all
honesty
> > frightens me.
>
> > the America I have known
> > my entire life has never reacted in a way as exemplified in your
examples
> > above.
>
> Right.
>
> So some catastrophic event occurred that caused a state to react in a way
> that infringes on the fundamental rights of a percentage of the
population.
>
> But somehow, you can rationalize the behaviour and actions of one state,
> yet you can say that the other is "evil" and that every single member of
> that state is "crazy", and therefore the deaths of a few thousand of them
> under a pre-emptive strike would just be a justifiable drag...

Yes I can say that a certain given country, or rather it's current reigning
regime is evil.
And no, not every person in that country need be crazy.
A few thousand deaths of enemy combatants fighting American troops do not
phase me, no.


> > But you know something Austin? How I felt when I was younger really is
> > different from how I feel
> > today. I think that when one is young they have little to really lose,
in
> > the form of family, children,
> > home, assets, career, whatever. It's damn easy to be liberal when you've
> got
> > nothing to lose.
>
> Sorry...that is just a load of shit.

No, not necessarily.

> Having kids has had the opposite effect...it has made me more acutely
aware
> of the importance of living as a community rather than in armed camps. It
> has taught me that difficult circumstances more that anything else are
> created by insecurities and by fear and by a refusal to accept the
humanity
> of your "enemy".

And having kids did not instill any sense of desire to protect them? Now and
in the future?
That's strange Austion...even animals do.

> > And it's
> > damn easy to be conservative when you do.
>
> Yes...it is damn easy to be "conservative". It is damn easy to be afraid.
It
> is damn easy to be selfish. It is damn easy to say "screw everybody else,
I
> don't care as long as my life is a-okay". It is damn easy to look at that
> extra $1 or two and think how you can spend it personally rather than
taking
> that extra risk and thinking about the power of that combined capital.

Funny..you are describing the Clinton years pretty well.

> > That's why young people, college students all over the
> > world often go head-to-head with the older reigning authorities.
>
> Herd mentalities exist everywhere.

Ah you have no sense of romance Austin...I like to consider the naivete of
youth.

> > If he truth be said, because of this, I don't really mind about Kay's
> > Anti-Bush, Anti-Americanism because
> > as I said, that kind of thing is not unusual at all for young people.
>
> I don't think Kay is as young as you think he/she is...
>
> > But it's his defense of the KJI regime that makes me believe that he is
> > retarded.
>
> Kay hasn't defended the KJI regime. Kay, like me, believes that the
current
> regime is not purposely starving its population. Famine has forced the
> regime to decide who and what are the important things to maintain.
>
Well then I am afraid we differ in our opinions. I am of the belief that the
KJI government
knew damn well from the outset just what "sacrifices" the people were going
to have to make
to support the Songun policy. I do not believe they could be that stupid.
And I'm not talking
about the well to do party affiliated families in Pyongyang either.

> What % of the GNP of the US is spent on military? How many people in the
US
> are starving? Are living in absolute poverty?
>
> Now...imagine if 1% of that military spending were instead spent of social
> programs. Does that mean that the US is *purposely* starving it populace
> because a % of it is starving?
>
> Now let's say that the US faces an earthquake in California with
> simultaneous flooding in the midwest for 3
> years. Let's say that Al-qaeda has become more bellicose in its
statements.
> Where do you think the resources will be spent? On ensuring that the
> populace is fed or that the military is strong and stable?

> Think long and hard about this (if you are capable).
>
Well I'll give you credit for creative thinking Austin, and I wson't even
top if off with an insult
as you are so fond of doing.
The example you gave is meaningless because the United States can and does
feed it's people while
maintaing the largest military on the face of this earth. It is larger than
the combined military of the
entire European Union.
And before you start telling me about the homeless in the US please don't
forget that we are talking about starvation on a
humanitarian crisis scale, as in an estimated 2,000,000 people dying of
starvation in the 1990s.
Finally, as far as the "threat" from Al Quaida, they are not the equivalent
of "bellicose statements", they have
already attacked thje United States killing some 3,000 people. The US if you
haven't realized it, is still in a
state of war with Al Quaida, has already fought a war in Afghanistan and in
Iraq, and I am not seeing
masses of people starving.
In comparison, North Korea despite technically being in a state of war since
1953, hasn't actually fought any
wars since then. Yet they need the Songun policy for what? That policy is
designed not only to defend
North Korea but to keep the populace under strict military control in a
constant state of "readiness".
It is one of the means by which the KJI regime maintains it's power. And the
people azre expectec to
make "sacrifices" to keep that regime in power. Wonderful little place,
isn't it?


> There are other reasons to criticize the North Korean regime, but accusing
> them of starving their populace on purpose is asinine.
>
Nope..you just know the whole picture. Being Korean doesn't make you an
automatic expert
on North Korea.

> > Also his argument that my "attacking NKorea" is the equivalent of
> "attacking ALL Koreans" which makes me believe that he is a closet Racist.
>
> I am more inclined to believe that you are just reading way too much into
> Kay's comments...
>
You are probably right there.

> > > > Most Korean-Americans think you two are as retarded as I do.
> > >
> > > Sure thing. Some people are so meek and pitiable that they always feel
> the need to convince themselves that they are part of the crowd.
>
> > Well...I am guessing that you are pointing your finger at people like
Dan
> > when you say that.
>
> Dan is who he is. I am referring to *you* specifically.

I have a need to be part of the crowd??? Funny everyone else seems to think
I am way out there on my own.

>
> > In the United States we are ALL Americans first. In WWII, the
> > Japanese-Americans made a choice.
>
> A "choice"? What "choice" did these Japanese-americans have?
>
> > Today there are Arab-Americans making a choice.
>
> What "choice" are you referring to?
>
Do I really need to spend another 15 minutes explaining this to you?
To quote you...go do some reading.
This is a very important part of modern American history, and if you are not
an American
I guess I can't fault you for not understanding it or not being able to
identify with it.

> > I don't think that handing out a Naturalization Certificate
> > to people like Kay makes them Americans. I think that when a person,
> > regardless of ethnic background chooses to support the United States
> First, they are truly Americans.
>
> Ah...and those Nth generation americans that don't agree with US policy
> are...not truly americans?
>
> It is precisely that statement (who is or is not a true american) which
> shows why americans inherently fan racism and will never rid themselves of
> it as a country.

Maybe not maybe yes, But the US has probably made more strides to eliminate
racism than most other countries.

>
> > Austin, if you really are not a Korean-American then all this doesn't
> > pertain to you. You are free to hate america all you want if you like.
>
> When you are sleeping beside an elephant, you feel every movement whether
> you like it or not...
> Austin

Fine but just be careful where you lie down to sleep.