On 10/22/2004 5:53 PM, cc wrote:
> "Scott Reynolds" <sar@gol.com> wrote in message
> 
>>And where would the effects of anti-Japan government propaganda rate?
>>Down around No. 13 or 14 perhaps?
> 
> They don't rate as causes but as effects, and means to reach the objectives
> of each propagandist party (South-Koreans having different objectives that
> Chinese).

You think that anti-Japan government propaganda is the *effect* of 
anti-Japanese sentiment among Chinese and Korean *young* people, rather 
than a major cause of it?

>>I was speaking of the Japanese government, not the people.
> 
> I don't think that was the Japanese government supporting the US policy, but
> US  supporting  the Japanese post-war regime (and economy), as part of their
> international policy. 

Here again you seem to have things backwards.

Note that I did not say that the stance of the Japanese government 
reflects the sentiments of the public. Often it does not, with the 
current Iraq policy as an obvious example. But the Japanese government 
has consistently supported US policy postwar. That is an 
incontrovertible fact.

> Chinese communism was linked to USSR, like Japan was linked to the US.

This "linkage" between China and the USSR weakened significantly (some 
would say turned into outright antagonism) in the 1960s, did it not?

> Without the US and USSR and their political antagonism, Japan and China
> wouldn't have been in positions of enemies at the occasion of Korean and
> Vietnamese conflicts.

That's a big what if.

> IMHO, when the Chinese government say they are not satisfied with Japanese
> textbooks, etc, that's not because they care...but it's because now they
> also have to campaign and get the votes of their hooligan lobby. They can no
> longer just hang all those that shout too loud. 

Look, the Chinese government does not have to "campaign and get the 
votes of" any lobbies. If they did they would have been thrown out of 
power a long time ago. In addition, your statements earlier that the 
"hooligan lobby" that hates Japan is a tiny minority would seem to be 
contradicted by your claim that they are somehow so powerful or 
influential that the Chinese government has to pander to them.

> It's like when Koizumi goes
> to Yasukuni or Bush/Kerry  to pray 5 minutes with Christian fanatics, or
> Chirac doing both + a mosquee +a synagogue+ the PSG hooligan-club  in the
> same day, I don't believe they actually care about religion (or
> soccer)...but they count the votes.

I think this is a gross oversimplification. Let it suffice to say that 
politicians do carefully craft their public actions to maximize their 
own appeal to voters, but that this tells us nothing about whether or 
not any one specific action is sincere or not.

-- 
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Scott Reynolds                                      sar@gol.com