On Wed, 12 Feb 2003 14:45:49 +0100, "Julius Dijksman"
<j.dijksman@ngi.nl> wrote:


Indeed it is situational. How many has not found them self scoring and
winning on a throw one can get to work good on practice, just because
in the match the situation was perfect?
Steering your oponent is a good way of getting in to those situations
that give u the rigth oportunity. But while competing I has found that
for me, countering my oponents moves and attempts to steer me has
given a far better result than too try to steer my self.On the other
hand I am trying to make him steer the way I want... So whos is doing
what can be a bit diffuse.
To do waht is not expected is a winnig move I agree. And
unconventional throws sure work. I've lost a match or two on them...
As a referee I can't say much, I've been on the courses needed. And
will start "working" as a referee at small competitions this spring to
get my license. So all my experince so far is by own competing and
some coaching. And as while acting as a coach and trainer I do like
when I see thes techniques. And I encourage to use them. But what I
try to get tehm to avoid is to take someone elses techniques and start
using them without first thinking does it suit me? Can I change it
somehow to make it suit me better? Since even if a throw can be the
difference from winning and losing a match. it can for the other
instead change a good match to an unfortunate failure. I've sort of
done that myslef... ;)
For me this throw is not that bad. I to weigh around 95Kg. And I'm not
verry short. 185cm. But I tend to get these tecniques to work somehow,
even if they are a bit low. Though had I been able to choose I would
have tried to work my way to an O soto gari or Tani otoshi.

>I agree with it too. But as Judo is situational and you never know what
>situation wil occur when, you never know what technique you wil use in
>advance. Ofcause you try to steer your opponent in a situation you can do
>the things you are good at. but your opponent has the same strategie at
>large. Only his good things and his chose of the moment differ. So as for
>the effectifness of training this throw I think it depends on your personal
>affection to the technique. As I recall Angel you are a referee too, and
>when you are judging you sometimes see these kind of unconventional throws
>mostly resulting in an opponent kaken by surprisse. and I think the value of
>these Kuzure's lies just in that, no one expects them to happen and
>therefore they are effective. I think that every A-class competition judoka
>has several of these thechniques.
>Fore me this thechnique is to heavy to use. I faile the strength in the
>upperbody to bring my opponent up and around to the back unless he or she is
>far beneath my wheight cattagory (-95) So I probably will never use it and
>use techniques as yoko wakare or some less known te wasa or a mkikomi.
>As you said the throws has to be natural for yourself. So I think this one
>can be very natural for a strong person with a swifst lifting action.
>
>Best regards
>Julius
>
>"Jigotai" <jigo@ono.es> schreef in bericht
>news:b2bu7e$1alt5p$1@ID-113466.news.dfncis.de...
>> I agree with you. However, you'll agree with me that to spend time and
>> energy by training a technique that you could use a few times in your
>life,
>> it is not such an efficient way of wasting your time. All of us have some,
>> let's say, "strange" technique that we use in the correct moment, a
>> r$(D??(Btechnique that goes out from us in a natural way. Some of us could have
>a
>> technique as Ura-nage. Some of us could have a technique as Hiza guruma.
>But
>> what makes that this "strange" techniques goes out it is our
>knwoledegement
>> of judo basis. I never practiced Tomoe Nage at uchi-komi and it is not one
>> of my favourites (personally I doesn$B!-(Bt like sutemis, but it is another
>> story ) and it is not even an option on my mind. However, I think I did it
>> twice on my life at randori and twice it was a perfect ippon. Maybe I
>chose
>> the correct moment. Maybe I made the perfect timing of the throw. Maybe my
>> rival was aslept :-) I don't know. What I know is this throw went out from
>> me. However, I never trained Tomoe Nage at any randori.
>>
>> Anyway, I have spent 10 years training Uchi-mata... and it doesn't work
>all
>> times. :-)
>>
>> "Irdium" <Irdium@nowere.at.al> escribi$(D??(B en el mensaje
>> news:s4oi4vsqf2mf1o077t1fm684ldc6vm7r68@4ax.com...
>> > On Sun, 22 Dec 2002 12:12:19 +0100, "Jigotai" <jigo@ono.es> wrote:
>> >
>> > >Nice performance!!!
>> > >If you asked me, I'd say it is a kind of Ura Nnage. However, I think
>that
>> > >technique should be very inneficient in a randori because if uke
>doesn't
>> > >help, tori is totally unable to do it. Not tsukuri, not kuzushi at all.
>> > >
>> > >It looks like a technique of WWF wrestling.
>> > >
>> > >Best regards
>> > >
>> > >Angel
>> >
>> > All  techniques is efficient in the right situation. Now wether that
>> > situation will apear is a whole different story. In my opinion,
>> > everyone should learn atlesat on throw that works in a way like Ura
>> > Nage. If this is a good ont to choose? Well it mainly depends on what
>> > other throws u have in your baskett. I would not advice anyone to do
>> > any special study of this thorw in order to use it in a competition. A
>> > good and solid O uchi gari or O soto gari is far more likely to be
>> > used. But if u feel this throw may fill a gap and give u a good
>> > oportunity, why not? I'm confident it works. But for me? probably not
>> > I'll just continue trying to get my Hisa guruma to work the way I
>> > want. =)
>> > Irdium
>>
>>
>

Irdium