Brett Robson wrote:
> necoandjeff wrote:
>> Brett Robson wrote:
>>
>>> necoandjeff wrote:
>>>
>>>> Brett Robson wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> necoandjeff wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Atheism isn't much more common in Japan than it is in the U.S.
>>>>>> They call themselves Buddhist and Shinto because they draw their
>>>>>> traditions from both. Most people are "spiritual" in the sense
>>>>>> that they believe in something more.
>>>>>
>>>>> Total crap. Japanese have some vague idea about people being
>>>>> spirits after they die, and that's it.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Sorry, what's the total crap part? Are people who believe that they
>>>> are spirits after they die atheists? Damn.
>>>
>>> What I said is clearly written above.
>>
>>
>> If you mean that the text renders clearly on my monitor you are
>> right.
>
> You learnt the "if you mean ... then ..." construct from Gowen,
> right?

Oh, you got me. Thirty six years of speaking English (well, more like thirty
four) and I hadn't come across that construction until Kevin Gowen.

> Are you fat too?

As a matter of fact I recently lost enough weight to get back down to the
weight I was in college. Quite trim actually. Thanks for asking.

>>
>> Hmmm. Shall be begin with what you think the difference is between
>> "mushinron" and "atheism?" Take your time Brett.
>
> It begins with understanding the first kanji "kami", but
> unfortunately you think kanji don't have meanings.

Yes, I'm also beginning to see those fabulous reading comprehension skills
at work too. I said that the fact that individual kanji used in names have
meanings does not mean that their names have meaning. And I underscored the
point by pointing out several kanji, like the na from Nara, for which the
majority of people are not even aware of any meaning.

And the middle kanji is "shin" not "kami." There is a subtle distinction
that is actually quite important. Or do you suppose the word "seishin" for
example is a Shinto term? In any event, mushinron is the Japanese equivalent
of atheism and, unlike some words, the overlap here in actual practice is
probably well over 90%. And the "well under 10%" that is left over is just
me being cautious more than anything. I can't actually think of how the
terms are used differently at the moment.

>>
>>> Ask all your thousands of Japanese friends this little question:
>>>
>>> "What religion are you?"
>>> if they answer Buddhist ask
>>> Please tell the fundamental beliefs of Buddhism.
>>> What have you ever done to affirm that you are a Buddhist.
>>
>>
>> Ah, I see. In Brett-world,  people who don't practice religion in a
>> Brett-approved manner -- those who can't clearly articulate their
>> dualism, or haven't engaged in some ritualistic affirmation of it --
>> are by default atheists. I'm beginning to see the problem here.
>>
>
> Yes, the problems is when dorks make stupid statments like
> "Atheism isn't much more common in Japan than it is in the U.S"
> then have to scramble with vague definitions of spirituality to
> try to justify it.

Go out and meet some actual people, learn what atheism really is, then we'll
talk.