"Declan Murphy" <declan_murphy@hotmail.com> wrote in message 
news:41D7E1E5.601@hotmail.com...
> Simon wrote:
>> "Declan Murphy" <declan_murphy@hotmail.com> wrote in message 
>> news:41C91AC6.2000808@hotmail.com...
>>
>>>Simon wrote:
>
>>>>>Bullets or ballots Simon? Ordnance or order?
>>>
>>>Any chance of answering a simple question?
>>
>> Ok, as I'm against violence I'd prefer not to have the killings and 
>> beatings.
>
> I'll take that as a general preference for a political solution then.
>
>>>>Count to 10 and take long deep breaths.
>>>>No matter what you say I do feel offended by people quoting republican 
>>>>songs.
>>>
>>>Then either grow up or get yourself some ear plugs.
>>>
>>>Oh Lord our God arise,
>>>Scatter our enemies,
>>>And make them fall
>>
>> My point is that when you quote the same lines as the terrorists don't be 
>> surprised if people make the obvious assumptions.
>
> You are over sensitive. The lines I quoted above are from "God save the 
> Queen". Nobody I know would assume people singing the British national 
> anthem are advocating violence and murder everytime they sing it.
>
> Similarly, no one I know singing "Kevin Barry" or an Orange dirge like 
> "The Boyne Water" (below), does so with similar thought to the actual 
> lyrics. Assuming they are sober enough to remember the lyrics of course. 
> Most of us hum and mumble where necessary.
>
> "King William called his officers, saying: Gentlemen, mind your station,
> And let your valour here be shown before this Irish nation,
> My brazen walls let no man break, and your subtle foes you'll scatter"
>
>>>Even if you can't forget, its about time you managed to forgive.
>>
>> Its not for me to forgive, that can only be done by their victims.
>
> Take a hint from some of the victims then, and make a donation
> http://www.soetrust.co.uk/
> http://www.childrenforpeace.org/
>
>>>>So I'm sorry but I find songs like the one you quoted very offensive. 
>>>>The people who planted those bombs like to quote songs like that also. 
>>>>They think they're heroes fighting for the cause.
>>>
>>>Yes, no doubt some/most of them do/did. Even Rusty Spence. But if the 
>>>experience of the ROI from 1921 is any guide, remove the cause and you 
>>>can remove the fighting.
>>
>> Yes but how do you satisfy both sides, if you unify Ireland the loyalists 
>> won't exactly thank you, and if you don't the republicans will eventually 
>> start bombing again.
>
> You don't need to "unify Ireland" in order to satisfy both sides. The 
> first step in the right direction was made when each extreme finally 
> agreed with the bulk of middle-of-the-road nationalist/unionist opinion 
> that the first thing to get rid of was the winner take all mentality.
>
>> Where's the middle ground when the goals of each side are so opposed.
>
> 71.2% of people in Northern Ireland voted "Yes" during the referendum on 
> the Good Friday Agreement. Thats a pretty substantial middle ground. As a 
> percentage of the nationalist's votes, the "Yes" was even higher.
>
>> I honestly would like to see a peaceful Ireland, but I can't see it 
>> happening, at least not until the current leaders have gone.
>
> Who better than the current leaders? It *has* to be them. The Ulster 
> Unionist, SDLP and Sinn Fein leadership have all agreed on the basics. 
> Pretty much the only opposition left to the Good Friday process are 20 or 
> so (unfortunately armed) freaks who have defected from the Provisional 
> IRA, and on the other side - the Paisleyites. I'm not particularly worried 
> about the political influence of the splitters, but if a rabble rouser 
> like Paisley and his hardline followers can be brought into a state 
> somewhat equivalent to sanity then crap like the following will be a thing 
> of the past:
>
> "We are not here to play games. We are here to save Ulster. If the parade 
> doesn't go down Garvaghy Road, there will be civil commotion to an extent 
> the authorities cannot handle." Ian Paisley, July 7, 1996
>
> Part of that "civil commotion" involved the murder of by arson of the 3 
> Quinn boys in Ballymoney. The main unionist newspaper (The Belfast 
> Telegraph) wrote against the campaign to march...
>
> "Did they really not know that once they had set their protest in motion 
> the bigoted extremists would embark on an orgy of lawbreaking and 
> destruction?"
>
> Unfortunately, the wisdom displayed in that editorial was written after 
> the deaths. But as I wrote above, who better than the current leaders? It 
> just *has* to be them.

Sorry I've taken a long time to reply but we've been away since Xmas.

Well I hate to say it but you're probably right about my being 
oversensitive. I'm not sure about the current leaders though, I can't see 
Paisley and his bunch looking for compromise, but you obviously know more 
about the subject than me.  I've just reread this thread and with the 
benefit of a few weeks away and I can see that I lost the argument a long 
time ago, so I'll stop digging now!
No hard feelings!



>
>
> -- 
> Non gratum anus rodentum
>