Path: ccsf.homeunix.org!ccsf.homeunix.org!news1.wakwak.com!nf1.xephion.ne.jp!onion.ish.org!news.heimat.gr.jp!news.jone-system.com!mmcatv.co.jp!news.moat.net!prodigy.com!newsmst01a.news.prodigy.com!prodigy.com!postmaster.news.prodigy.com!newssvr29.news.prodigy.com.POSTED!9a2493fe!not-for-mail From: "necoandjeff" Newsgroups: fj.life.in-japan,soc.culture.japan,sci.lang.japan References: <1v00d.14214$FV3.14160@newssvr17.news.prodigy.com> <%610d.14217$FV3.7873@newssvr17.news.prodigy.com> <2qcjbiFst5tkU1@uni-berlin.de> <2qcmltFtp9kgU3@uni-berlin.de> <2Ik0d.9604$ZC7.722@newssvr19.news.prodigy.com> <1si2d.3061$UF6.2254@newssvr15.news.prodigy.com> Subject: Re: gifts for Japanese Lines: 80 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-2022-jp" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Message-ID: NNTP-Posting-Host: 63.203.71.190 X-Complaints-To: abuse@prodigy.net X-Trace: newssvr29.news.prodigy.com 1095351600 ST000 63.203.71.190 (Thu, 16 Sep 2004 12:20:00 EDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 16 Sep 2004 12:20:00 EDT Organization: SBC http://yahoo.sbc.com X-UserInfo1: FKPO@MC@@S@GRTPY[BCD^VX@WB]^PCPDLXUNNHLHEQR@ETUCCNSKQFCY@TXDX_WHSVB]ZEJLSNY\^J[CUVSA_QLFC^RQHUPH[P[NRWCCMLSNPOD_ESALHUK@TDFUZHBLJ\XGKL^NXA\EVHSP[D_C^B_^JCX^W]CHBAX]POG@SSAZQ\LE[DCNMUPG_VSC@VJM Date: Thu, 16 Sep 2004 16:20:00 GMT Xref: ccsf.homeunix.org fj.life.in-japan:18496 "Musashi" wrote in message news:1si2d.3061$UF6.2254@newssvr15.news.prodigy.com... > > "necoandjeff" wrote in message > news:odi2d.21809$aM4.9584@newssvr29.news.prodigy.com... > > "Musashi" wrote in message > > news:ZQh2d.3032$hv6.2388@newssvr15.news.prodigy.com... > > > > > > "Shez" wrote in message > > > news:ghLW9WMRVJSBFwYz@zerex.nospam.co.uk... > > > > In the faraway land of sci.lang.japan, Musashi > > > > > said: > > > > >> Hmm. So you're saying that the British are not Europeans? > > > > > > > > > >Yes and No. If we are speaking strictly in a geographical sense, then > > > > >obviously British are > > > > >Europeans. But if we are talking about "how a people or nation > > perceives > > > and > > > > >calls themselves" > > > > >then I have met plenty of British people who rather pride themselves > in > > > > >being "British or English" > > > > >and consider themselves seperate from those on the "continent". > Perhaps > > > this > > > > >has somtehign to > > > > >do with being an island country, in which case it is understandable > > that > > > a > > > > >similar type of mentality > > > > >would have developed in Japan. > > > > > > > > Yes, Britain and Japan are very much alike in this respect, and indeed > > > > in many aspects of their historical relations with our continental > > > > neighbours - wars, invasions, cultural & linguistic influences (e.g. > the > > > > adoption of the Roman alphabet in Britain and Kanji in Japan, along > with > > > > a lot of loan words from what was otherwise an unrelated language). > Both > > > > were even saved from invasion by a divine wind that dispersed an > > > > invading fleet, IIRC. > > > > > > > > > > Finally someone who understands this. > > > I've never had much reception to this idea from > > > my American friends. > > > > I agree to an extent. But people sometimes tend to use "island nation > > mentality" to mean something much bigger. What I have an objection to is > the > > tendency Japanese have of explaining everything by pointing out that they > > are "shimaguni," even things with respect to which Japan and England are > > very, very different. > > > > Jeff > > > > Can you give an example of that? > My objection to the shimaguni mentality concept is that some people use it > as an excuse for everything including lack of attention to human rights, > racism, > sexual equality in the workplace, etc etc. While the shimaguni mentality may > explain much of Japanese history, Japan really hasn't been a shimaguni since > the 20th century began so I don't see it > an excuse for not moving forward like any developed nation in the 21st > century. Those are all great examples of what I'm thinking of. Jeff