Path: ccsf.homeunix.org!ccsf.homeunix.org!news1.wakwak.com!nf1.xephion.ne.jp!onion.ish.org!news.daionet.gr.jp!news.yamada.gr.jp!newsfeed.media.kyoto-u.ac.jp!headwall.stanford.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!shelby.stanford.edu!not-for-mail From: mtfester@netMAPSONscape.net Newsgroups: fj.life.in-japan Subject: Re: Initial impressions from the Japanese premier of Fahrenheit 9/11 Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 23:49:46 +0000 (UTC) Organization: Subtlties R'nt Us Lines: 49 Sender: Mike Fester Message-ID: References: <2ol61qFbdbunU34@uni-berlin.de> <2ost35Fd9vt9U29@uni-berlin.de> <4129F134.31A16BA7@yahoo.co.jp> <4129F92A.9566C9C3@yahoo.co.jp> <412B1414.6777F1E0@yahoo.co.jp> <412B4D17.E09FF497@yahoo.co.jp> <412C6166.B59653E1@yahoo.co.jp> <412CDECF.25248120@yahoo.co.jp> Reply-To: mtfester@netscape.net NNTP-Posting-Host: haven.stanford.edu X-Trace: news.Stanford.EDU 1093477786 23323 171.67.16.19 (25 Aug 2004 23:49:46 GMT) X-Complaints-To: news@news.stanford.edu User-Agent: tin/1.5.12-20020311 ("Toxicity") (UNIX) (Linux/2.4.26 (i686)) Xref: ccsf.homeunix.org fj.life.in-japan:17412 Eric Takabayashi wrote: > mtfester@netMAPSONscape.net wrote: >> >> There can be plea bargains, >> >> > You mean deciding beforehand on a possibly lesser charge, >> >> I believe that's part of the process. > But it's still not a full length trial, to "know" for sure or as much as they > can. Uh, where is it written that a trial is required? Certainly, not all criminals or victims desire it. >> > instead of the trial process to >> > "prove" what actually happened, and whether or not it constitutes a crime? >> >> Sorry, but that's nonsense. In a plea bargain, there's already admission >> of a crime, > Perhaps to only what the prosecution believes they can make stick, not what > actually happened. And very often, they don't know what happened. They DELIBERATELY make the most severe charge they can justify in hope of getting a plea bargain to a lesser charge. > Don't be coy. I have many faults, but that's not one of them. >> and very often the victim (whom you suddenly don't care >> about) is part of the decision making process. > Also limiting themselves to what they believe the prosecution can make stick, Sorry, but you're wrong. You are not entitled to speak for all victims, however much you pretend otherwise. > Why does my standing up for trials suddenly make you feel I do not care for > victims (crime victims or those falsely accused)? It's your disdain for things like plea bargains (not to mention, your ignorance of the processes involved.) Mike