FreddieN wrote:

> > Yes, I see a lot of anti-Japanese sentiment from especially Chinese and
> Koreans.
> >
> > No mystery why.
>
> Why is it not a mystery Eric?

Because of Japanese history, and what many modern people think of it, or I
should say don't think or know about it, and don't want to think or know about
it, much less do anything about it.

For example, http://tinyurl.com/5nlyo claims:

One would truly become speechless, if recalls the fact that Japan extorted a
phenomenal huge sum of JiaWu War reparation - Treaty of Maguan in 1895 from
China, i.e. 231 million taels of silver on top of Taiwan, the Pescadores and
Liaotung peninsula etc .......

And later in year 1901, nearly bankrupt China also had to pay 450 million taels
of silver in 39 years with 4% yearly interest for the Boxer Rebellion war
indemnity - Boxer Protocol to eight foreign countries i.e. U.S., Britain,
France, Germany, Russia, Italy, Austria-Hungary, and Japan.

So great vast sum of money for any wealthy nation let alone one as poor as
China, that much of the money was later earmarked by the U.S. and later
Britain, for overseas education of Chinese students as Boxer Fellowship, e.g.
Chen Ning Yang, a Nobel Prize-winning theoretical physicist for his famous
Yang-Mills Theory for our current understanding of subatomic particles. The
fund later formed the basis of famous China's MIT, Tsinghua University.

Of which Japan got 34.7 million plus interest of 41 million taels of silver.

China could not pay Japan the phenomenal huge indemnity and had to borrow money
from several western countries and paid heavy interest.

Total War Indemnity paid to Japan alone was a staggering capital 265 million
plus interest 321 million taels of silver (i.e. Total 586 million taels of
silver in 1895, about 7 times China's annual revenue).

But in vivid contrast, San Francisco Peace Treaty reveals that the reparations
matter was merely postponed until Japan has the financial means to pay..

Yet, Japan has been maintaining that no single yen should be paid to any
Chinese after its own defeat. According to the Japanese military record, 2.8
million Japanese soldiers were killed during WWII, of which nearly 2 millions
Japanese soldiers were killed in China.

It is estimated that China's direct and in-direct economic loss due to Japan's
14 years invasion comes to many hundreds of billions, or trillion dollors if
interest are included. And the casualties 20 - 30 millions Chinese.

Not to mention large numbers of Korean (9 million), Indonesia (4 million),
Vietnam (2 million), India (1.5 million), Filippine (1 million), and other
Asian countries Malaysia, Burma, Thailand, Singapore ..........

[snip]

I see many questionable things on that site, particularly the numbers involved.

But the point is made: Japan is ONE of the parties (as well as Western powers
and Chinese leaders themselves) responsible for the unrest and poverty in China
throughout the past century.

But what will modern people do about it? Certainly, Japanese do not want to pay
direct forms of compensation to China (and don't give me anything about the San
Francisco Treaty - if Japan or Japanese wanted to pay anyone for damages during
the war, they could pay it of their own free will instead of avoiding
responsibility hiding behind interpretations of treaties or Japanese court
rulings).

> Just exactly what did young Japanese people today do
> personally to deserve that kind of racism and hatred?

Such as the soccer players who were booed and had bottles thrown at them in
China?

Probably nothing.

But "young Japanese people today" since you care to make it so specific, aren't
doing much to rectify the acts of their ancestors either, or to improve their
image of Chinese, or understand why many Chinese may feel the way they do. Nor
do they understand the handicaps of history that China has to overcome, when
looking down upon Chinese for not having the same economy, technology or
lifestyle as Japanese.

> Didn't Ernest teach you that you can't blame EVERYONE because SOME people
> did something very bad? I wish you;d pay more attention to Ernest because I
> happen to think he's a very smart person.

I am sure he is. But he did not teach me any of that, because it doesn't need
to be taught to me, nor do I blame EVERYONE because of SOME people.

> > > Have you ever noticed that you hardly ever see any such activity by
> Japanese posters, with the exception of crazy Kaz?
> >
> > Yes, I also don't see much anti-Japanese sentiment from Japanese.
>
> What is the point of that remark?

The previous poster claimed that Chinese posters spew their anti-Japanese hate,
but they hardly ever see any such activity by "Japanese" posters.

I agreed with the previous poster. "Japanese" posters hardly ever spew
anti-Japanese hate.

> My point was that while you see tons of anti-Japanese sentiment from
> Chinese, you do not see much anti-Chinese sentiment from Japanese. Surely you
> caught that, right?

I do not see much of identifiable Japanese posters in English, period.

Now try what you see and hear in Japan (thankfully on the decline recently
after people have got over their hysteria about lockpicking) regarding Chinese.
The blame on the behavior (and attitude) of many Chinese at the soccer stadium
was put on the Chinese government and their allegedly anti-Japanese history
education, not on the war itself, or what the Japanese did back then, or the
lack of progress addressing the war now.

> > I do see a lot of anti-Asian or anti-foreigner in general from Japanese,
> particularly against Chinese. Even Tokyo Metropolitan Police had prepared
> a "If you think they are Chinese, immediately call 110 [police emergency]"
> campaign, printing up 700 posters to be distributed to 96 departments.
>
> Do you think that the fact that Japan does have a problem with illegal
> aliens, crime, gangs, etc and that they happen to be mostly illegal Chinese
> has anything to do wit the above?

Yes, as in survey, about half of respondents claim their greatest fear is
foreigners (number two on the list), or that the increase in crime is due to
foreigners. (The number one fear was young people.)

> Do you honestly believe that the police have no grounds at all, and that
> they arbitrarily picked on "chinese" out of pure racism and bigotry?

Yes, considering the scale (small) of foreign crime and criminals, Japanese
officials and people should not put the blame for crime or increases in crime
on such a small portion of the population. Even just juveniles aged 15-19 are
responsible for more crime, even killings (that police know of, of course) than
all foreign criminals.

So in the US due to the high crime rate, and how a lot of it actually is
attributed to black people, should the American police or FBI be telling
Americans to call 911 if they THINK someone is Black, or hear someone "talking
Black" as Japanese were intended to call police if they SAW or HEARD someone
they thought was Chinese? (Note, I am not intending to promote discrimination
against black people if I refer to US crime statistics.)

You do not see a problem with this, or how such an attitude would be similar?
(With the obvious exception that Chinese or foreigners in general are
responsible for a small part of reported crimes in Japan, not widely out of
proportion to their representation in the population.)

> > > What the poster said is true,.
> >
> > "Chinese people just pervert everything to make Japanese look bad"
> >
> > It is true? "Everything"? Even 51% or 99.999% is not "everything". I would
> use the terms "most things" or "almost everything", unless it was a simple
> generalization such as "Japanese have naturally dark hair".
>
> Come on Eric, the poster obviously didn't mean "everything" in a literal
> sense.
> It's silly to argue about that.

Again, are you sure? That same poster today wrote

"Everywhere they go, these chinese people seem to spread hatred, to the
point that you almost understand why Japanese had to be so aggressive
during the WWI and WWII toward the Japanese.

It's a scary thing when you to get to understand Japanese aggression
and cruelty, by witnessing Chinese people's perversion."

Even if it is a generalization or exaggeration, do you have no problem with
this poster or their view at all?

"What the poster said is true"?

> > "Japanese people are very honest about their feelings"
> >
> > Really? Even Japanese will claim otherwise. Not that they are liars, but
> that how they act or what they say depends on the audience and situation.
> Which
> is why I asked the poster to tell us how to be sure Japanese actually meant
> yes or no, especially in a professional or diplomatic situation.
>
> Do you speak Japanese Eric?

Yes.

> The above is textbook material for a western book on Japan.

What of it? Will you answer the question for the poster, or explain how what
they said is true?

> > "Even American people themselves wish they were born with blonde hair and
> blue eyes. Especially, American women."
> >
> > Really? Is that why hair dyes come in a variety of colors including even
> red, green or purple, and colored contacts also come in at least six colors
> also including purple? Because especially American women wish they had been
> born blonde with blue eyes?
> >
> > "In fact, blonde hair is something that every human-being wish they were
> born with."
> >
> > How strange that even Caucasian readers think otherwise.
> >
> Eric..in the US women HAVE been enamored with dying their hair "blonde".

Only blonde?

> Look at all the big time accresses of the 50s and 60s. Admittedly this was a
> fad which still exists today but to a much lesser degree. But to respond to
> the
> poster like they just made something crazy up is wrong.

It's not crazy. It's just a wildly sweeping generalization which is how I
responded to it.

> > > the CCP made Japan-Hating part of their education, to the extent that it
> has gotten out of control.
> >
> > Yes, allegedly promoting anti-Japanese sentiment as part of Chinese
> education is considered a problem by Japan,
>
> Actually it is considered a problem by China. Didn't you see the photos of
> Chinese police in riot gear beating the living daylights out of anti-Japanese
>
> Chinese soccer spectators?

In response to criticism about allowing such behavior in the first place
allegedly due to concern over how such behavior or toleration of such behavior
would go over in light of the fact that Beijing will host the Olympics in the
future.

If China considers their education system or the content of their curriculum a
problem, they can change it so it is not considered "propaganda" by such as
Japanese.

I don't know what "propaganda" the Japanese media are referring to.

> > because Japanese policy makers prefer people, particularly their own
> children, not to ever hear about most things that Japanese did in WWII and
> the half century before, or the details of them.
> >
> Sounds like you're own opinion there Eric. Unless you are or have been a
> Japanese politician.

Really? It is "my" opinion? So the reports of how Japanese textbooks are
monitored and altered to avoid addressing Japanese wartime atrocities are
untrue, and even the Japanese reporters and critics are just hysterical liars?
Then what is your own "opinion" regarding the reason Japanese do not (wish to)
dwell on how WWII affected OTHER countries? (They will take time out of their
regular curriculum to include "peace education" to hear from elderly Japanese
and others about how sad life was for Japanese or in Japan in WWII. Many will
even make a point of having their school trip destination Okinawa or Hiroshima,
to hear about the poor suffering Japanese. But how many (of course some do)
will hear from former Korean comfort women, survivors of Nanking, or their
representatives?)

> > Meanwhile, Japan is one of China's top trading partners, to the point that
> much of Japan's economic recovery is directly related to trade with China;
> hundreds of thousands of Chinese also go to Japan every year to study the
> language and business or even stay to work or settle permanently, and
> Japanese culture and entertainment are also popular in China.
> >
> Absolutely true.

Then the previous poster cannot also be saying something true about the same
issue.

> > Yes, Japan hating has grown out of control in China.
> >
> So we agree on this.

No, I was being sarcastic, because it is not true.

> > "Prejudiced against all people who belong to other races"
>
> Well unfortunbately I don;'t fit that one. In fact most of the definitions
> don't really fit.
> However I can assure you that everyone, ok,.most everyone. I've argued with
> has called me a racist.

People call me many things here. Almost all are wrong.

But I am curious why you would say or imply these negative things about
Chinese.

> > That's pretty serious. And I can't be sure of that about anyone I know.
> >
> > > Just about everyone is to varying degrees, some pretentious ones just
> like to pretend that their shit doesn't smell.
> >
> > Correct. Which is why you should not be surprised or offended to have it
> pointed out about someone else, and why it makes a poor attempt at insult
> or to shock on fjlij when used on a Japanese man with a British PhD who also
> makes some simple generalizations about Chinese.
>
> I am neither surprised nor offended.
> Who is the Japanese man with a British PhD, and just exactly
> what does this persons acedemic credentials have anything to do
> with this discussion or topic?

It's from another thread which grew out of control, all because I asked why
someone was offended by another's assertions that Chinese are "more emotional"
"more political" than Japanese, or that they are prone to "exaggerate" because
that poster claimed that it must have some negative connotation.

> > But I notice that a person with a female Western sounding name avoids any
> criticism for a much more serious and sweeping negative generalization
> about Chinese on said group.
>
> I don't know who this poster is, and like you, I have no idea as to gender
> or ethnic background.
> But I have looked at the various responses this person has thrown around,
> and while some things are said with an air of certainty, I hardly see a
> pattern of bigotry or racism. At least no more than anyone else.

I beg your pardon. Again:

"Everywhere they go, these chinese people seem to spread hatred, to the
point that you almost understand why Japanese had to be so aggressive
during the WWI and WWII toward the Japanese.

"It's a scary thing when you to get to understand Japanese aggression
and cruelty, by witnessing Chinese people's perversion."

"Chinese people just pervert everything to make Japanese look bad"

You see nothing out of the ordinary here, even online?

What if people said the same of recent Israeli policy and the Holocaust? What
if people said the same of US history, and more recent acts of terror against
Americans? Would you see a problem there?

If there is nothing wrong, or at least nothing out of the ordinary, why does
the Japanese man with the British PhD get crap for his posts (or others with
Japanese handles for their posts), while this poster with a western female name
does not need to enter into a hundred post argument to defend herself and her
anti-Chinese views?

--
 "I'm on top of the world right now, because everyone's going to know that I
can shove more than three burgers in my mouth!"